MacWorld 1997 January/Macworld (1997-01).dmg/Shareware World/Info/CSMP Digest/CSMP Digest Vol 4 No 8.text

Text File | 1996-10-12 | 55KB | 1,482 lines

C.S.M.P. Digest             Tue, 08 Oct 96       Volume 4 : Issue 8

Today's Topics:

        Advice on marketing new product: shareware or commercial?
        Disabling Macsbug?
        Drag Manager questions
        Error in Technote 1069 confirmed
        Font Editor
        How to do scripting on a Mac?
        MacODBC & CFM68K
        MacOS 8 suggestion (Re: Disk space efficiency)
        OpenDoc for Linux?
        Renaming Files
        Screensaver
        Sprockets on 68K Macs?
        Status of Printer Port? Busy, empty, availlble?
        String Manipulation in Pascal
        What to use on an old Mac ?
        [ANN]  CodeWarrior 10 installation errata
        [Q] Playing a sound with a loop back
        getting INIT code to load from within the system file
        long ints- help!
        which book?



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-------------------------------------------------------

>From [e-mail] (Reuben King)
Subject: Advice on marketing new product: shareware or commercial?
Date: Wed, 18 Sep 1996 14:57:12 -0500
Organization: None

Hi peoplez!

We are fixing to release a small little programming tool for a 4GL
environment that basically replaces the built in editor of this
environment..  It's a dinky little guy, but works real well.

Right now we are debating internally over whether or not it should be a
commercial product or a shareware product.  Either way the price will be
around $40.

My argument is for shareware.  In my days of computing, practically every
'dinky' little app/extension/whatever that became successful and widely
used was marketed as shareware.  I've seen some SUPER utilities (like
PopUpFolder, which I swear by) that are absolutely wonderful but are
marketed as commercial software, and never amount to much of anything.

But, my bosses want return on their development efforts sooner rather than
later (which can be understood).  but, personally, I feel that there would
be greater long term exposure and benefit by marketing as shareware.

Any thoughts/experiences to share?

Thanks!


+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (Jay Farrell)
Date: Wed, 18 Sep 1996 18:23:05 -0400
Organization: Jayfar's Web

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Reuben King)
wrote:

| Hi peoplez!
|
| We are fixing to release a small little programming tool for a 4GL
| environment that basically replaces the built in editor of this
| environment..  It's a dinky little guy, but works real well.
|
| Right now we are debating internally over whether or not it should be a
| commercial product or a shareware product.  Either way the price will be
| around $40.
|
| My argument is for shareware.  In my days of computing, practically every
| 'dinky' little app/extension/whatever that became successful and widely
| used was marketed as shareware.  I've seen some SUPER utilities (like
| PopUpFolder, which I swear by) that are absolutely wonderful but are
| marketed as commercial software, and never amount to much of anything.
|
| But, my bosses want return on their development efforts sooner rather than
| later (which can be understood).  but, personally, I feel that there would
| be greater long term exposure and benefit by marketing as shareware.
|
| Any thoughts/experiences to share?

None, but I suggest you read:

    <URL:http://www.bungie.com/soapbox.html>

Distribution Myths and Lies by Alexander Seropian, CEO of Bungee Software.
Makes other than shareware distribution look like a real ugly business to
say the least.

Say, that wouldn't be a new script editor for FMP, would it??  %-)  I'd
happily pay $40 for that.

Cheers,
Jayfar

   ////~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~////
  ////   The Mops Page    <URL:http://www.netaxs.com/~jayfar/mops.html>    ////
 ////~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~////
////   Mops is Mike Hore's freeware Forth/Smalltalk hybrid for Macintosh ////
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
  Jay Farrell     [e-mail]        Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, USA

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (Matt Bishop)
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996 20:36:36 -0500
Organization: Zippo

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Reuben King)
wrote:

> Hi peoplez!
>
> We are fixing to release a small little programming tool for a 4GL
> environment that basically replaces the built in editor of this
> environment..  It's a dinky little guy, but works real well.
>
> Right now we are debating internally over whether or not it should be a
> commercial product or a shareware product.  Either way the price will be
> around $40.
>

SHAREWARE for sure.  It is cheaper, faster, and more focused.  Your return
will be higher without paying for all the boxes/distribution/retailer
cut.  Just advertise it in trade mags/in newsgroups and distribute it from
a website/info-mac.

We do pay our shareware fees, by the way.  The people who don't pay
shareware fees are the same people that pirate software, so either way you
don't get any revenue from them.

Netscape makes millions and millions off of their shareware product
"Navigator."  Who is going to tell them they are making a mistake?

---------------------------

>From [e-mail] (David)
Subject: Disabling Macsbug?
Date: 16 Sep 1996 02:07:56 -0400
Organization: Interport Communications Corp.

Does anyone know how to prevent Macsbug from working in a program? I have
seen this done (so that the interrupt switch just does nothing), and
believe it has something to do with "interrupt vectors," but my
understanding of these is low and so my capability to modify them is even
less. A pointer to IM (didn't find it in a search) would be great, and if
anyone has one, a code snippet (Pascal or C) would be wonderful. Thanks
very much for your help!

David

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (Paul Baxter)
Date: Mon, 16 Sep 1996 07:40:19 -0500
Organization: IDT Corporation

In article <51iqrs$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (David) wrote:

> Does anyone know how to prevent Macsbug from working in a program? I have
> seen this done (so that the interrupt switch just does nothing), and
> believe it has something to do with "interrupt vectors," but my
> understanding of these is low and so my capability to modify them is even
> less. A pointer to IM (didn't find it in a search) would be great, and if
> anyone has one, a code snippet (Pascal or C) would be wonderful. Thanks
> very much for your help!
>
> David

Hi,
   One approach would be to change the trap address of _Debugger and
_DebugStr to call your own routine using SetrapAddress (pretty sneaky!).

--
Paul Baxter
[e-mail]

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (Ben Trumbull)
Date: Mon, 16 Sep 1996 13:05:16 -0400
Organization: Yale University

In article <51iqrs$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (David) wrote:

> Does anyone know how to prevent Macsbug from working in a program? I have
> seen this done (so that the interrupt switch just does nothing), and
> believe it has something to do with "interrupt vectors," but my
> understanding of these is low and so my capability to modify them is even
> less. A pointer to IM (didn't find it in a search) would be great, and if
> anyone has one, a code snippet (Pascal or C) would be wonderful. Thanks
> very much for your help!
>
> David

Can't say I can contribute to the answer, but why ?  just why would you
ever want to do this ?  (seriously, my imagination must be limited)

terminally curious,

Ben
___________________________________________________________________
Benjamin Trumbull
[e-mail]
Yale University
       You can't be in hell; you can still read your e-mail

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (Bill Stewart-Cole)
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 1996 00:56:29 -0500
Organization: ZOG

In article <[e-mail]>,
[e-mail] (Ben Trumbull) wrote:

>In article <51iqrs$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (David) wrote:
>
>> Does anyone know how to prevent Macsbug from working in a program? I have
[...]
>
>Can't say I can contribute to the answer, but why ?  just why would you
>ever want to do this ?  (seriously, my imagination must be limited)

It might be quite useful to make it harder for crackers to figure out
exactly what is done in a copy-protection or serialization routine.

I don't believe it is completely possible however. On some Macs, the
programmer's switch invokes a hardware interrupt whose catch vector (or
whatever they call it: the address to run from when the interrupt occurs)
is stored in a cpu register.

For software-mediated drops to MacsBug, which I think is always the case
with PPC machines, it might be possible. However you would probably have
to dig into the Motorola/IBM-reserved areas of low memory and figure out
exactly what vector to clobber. You may not be able to do this at all.

In any case, you can bet on such code breaking under Copland, and possibly
in some cases where VM is on.

--
Bill Stewart-Cole

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (Patrick Stadelmann)
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 1996 11:54:15 +0100
Organization: University of Neuchatel

In article <[e-mail]>,
[e-mail] (Ben Trumbull) wrote:

> In article <51iqrs$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (David) wrote:
>
> > Does anyone know how to prevent Macsbug from working in a program? I have
> > seen this done (so that the interrupt switch just does nothing), and
> > believe it has something to do with "interrupt vectors," but my
> > understanding of these is low and so my capability to modify them is even
> > less. A pointer to IM (didn't find it in a search) would be great, and if
> > anyone has one, a code snippet (Pascal or C) would be wonderful. Thanks
> > very much for your help!
> >
> > David
>
> Can't say I can contribute to the answer, but why ?  just why would you
> ever want to do this ?  (seriously, my imagination must be limited)

Several software try to disable MacsBug for copy-protection purposes.
This is supposed to make it harder to hack the program to have it work
without a hardware key, for instance. But it also makes it more challenging
and more interesting to hack...

Patrick

--
Patrick Stadelmann <[e-mail]>

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (Matthew Mucker)
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 1996 12:47:00 +0500
Organization: Internet America

> > In article <51iqrs$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (David) wrote:
> >
> > > Does anyone know how to prevent Macsbug from working in a program? I have
> > > seen this done (so that the interrupt switch just does nothing), and
> > > believe it has something to do with "interrupt vectors," but my
> > > understanding of these is low and so my capability to modify them is even
> > > less. A pointer to IM (didn't find it in a search) would be great, and if
> > > anyone has one, a code snippet (Pascal or C) would be wonderful. Thanks
> > > very much for your help!

I can't tell you specifics of how to do this, but I can tell you about
interrupt vectors.  Maybe that would allow you to understand a little more
about what's going on.

An "Interrupt" is a signal to the microprocessor.  If the computer is
designed properly, when the microprocessor gets an interrupt signal, it
stops doing whatever it is doing, and handles the interrupt.  Interrupts
are used in situations where events must be handled RIGHT NOW-- one
example would be in a serial port, where if the microprocessor did not
read an incoming character, it would be overwritten by the next incoming
character.  When the serial port receives a character, it generates an
interrupt.  The microprocessor stops running whatever program it is
running, receives the character from the serial port, resets the
interrupt, and continues running the program it was running.

This, of course, is grossly oversimplified.  Now let's move up a level of
complexity.

There are many systems on most computers that could generate an
interrupt.  Virtually any I/O device, the screen refresh signal, and even
little things like a programmer switch.

When a processor receives an interrupt, the first thing it must do is
figure out which device is requesting the interrupt.  I am totally
ignorant in this area as it applies to Motorola microprocessors, so we'll
assume it just happens.  Let's say that the processor discovers the source
of the interrupt is the programmer's swith.  It then looks up the routine
it should execute for this particular interrupt.  It does this by way of
"interrupt vectors"  that are usually stored in a "vector table."  I shall
illustrate.

Let's say MyProcessor is capable of receiving eight different interrupts.
We'll call them interrupt 1, 2, 3... etc.  The processor is manufactured
so that it's interrupt table starts at address $000A.  An interrupt table
might look like this:

$000A  0A00 0B00 0C00 0D00 0E00 0F00 0010 0020

Which means that the byte stored at address $000A is $0A, the next byte is
$00, the next is $0b, etc.

Now, when the processor gets an interrupt, it looks up the "vector" in the
"table."  For interrupt 1, it looks at address $000A.  For interrupt 2, it
looks at address $000C.  For interrupt 3, it looks at address $000E.  Et
cetera.

The "vector" returned will be the address of the routine that will handle
that particular interrupt.  For instance, for interrupt 6, the vector is
stored at $0015.  The two bytes stored starting at this location are $0F
and $00.  The processor would then jump to the routine at address $0F00
and run that routine.

Again, this is oversimplified, and I may be making minor errors, but the
theory is sound.

To disable the programmers switch, you must do several things.

1) Write a machine-language routine that will return from an interrupt
without doing anything.

2) Store that routine in a particular place in memory.

3) Tell the microprocessor not to allow any interruts to take place

4) Point the programmers switch interrupt vector at your do-nothing routine.

5) Turn the interrupts back on.

Now this sounds like a lot of work, but it really isn't so bad.  (Then
again, all of my interrupt routines were written on a Commodore 64, which
is where most of my theory above came from.  I may be oversimplifying.)
Steps 3 and 5 are necessary to prevent disaster should the user press the
programmers switch while you are in the middle of altering the vector.  If
you had changed one byte of the vector but not the other when the switch
is pressed, Ka-BLAM-o!  The vector is pointing to an undefined routine,
which more often than not causes your program to go down in a glorious
blaze of flames.  (I am speaking figuratively and not literally.  A
dangling vector will NOT cause your computer to combust.)

And that's what "interrupt vectors" are.

-Matt

--
Life is 10% what happens to you, and 90% how you respond to what happens to you.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (Ben Trumbull)
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 1996 16:51:05 -0400
Organization: Yale University

In article <[e-mail]>,
[e-mail] (Paul Baxter) wrote:

> Hi,
>    One approach would be to change the trap address of _Debugger and
> _DebugStr to call your own routine using SetrapAddress (pretty sneaky!).
>

Nifty.  But nothing that does this will see disk space on *my* machine,
unless your name is Steve Jasik.

terminally curious,

Ben
___________________________________________________________________
Benjamin Trumbull
[e-mail]
Yale University
       You can't be in hell; you can still read your e-mail

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (Peter W. Gillgasch)
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 1996 17:40:44 +0200
Organization: Organised ? Who ? Me ?

Ben Trumbull <[e-mail]> wrote:

> Can't say I can contribute to the answer, but why ?  just why would you
> ever want to do this ?  (seriously, my imagination must be limited)

Eh, copy protection ? Avoiding competitors to sneak into your code
to check how you do your magic ?

My imagination is unlimited :-)

-- Peter

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (Adam Winer)
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 1996 21:52:38 -0800
Organization: Oracle Corporation

In article <[e-mail]>,
[e-mail] (Paul Baxter) wrote:

> In article <51iqrs$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (David) wrote:
>
> > Does anyone know how to prevent Macsbug from working in a program? I have
> > seen this done (so that the interrupt switch just does nothing), and
> > believe it has something to do with "interrupt vectors," but my
> > understanding of these is low and so my capability to modify them is even
> > less. A pointer to IM (didn't find it in a search) would be great, and if
> > anyone has one, a code snippet (Pascal or C) would be wonderful. Thanks
> > very much for your help!
> >
> > David
>
> Hi,
>    One approach would be to change the trap address of _Debugger and
> _DebugStr to call your own routine using SetrapAddress (pretty sneaky!).

AFAIK, this actually doesn't work.  I once tried writing
up a hack that did just this.  It was a quick-hack OpenDoc part
that patched DebugStr and displayed all the strings passed in - kinda
neat, because adding an instance of the part would let you intercept
all debug strings without breaking into MacsBug.  Unfortunately,
MacsBug still got all the debug strings.  I didn't have enough
time to look into this, so I never found out why it happens.
Anyone know?

-- Adam Winer
[e-mail]

--
Adam Winer
[e-mail]
Technical Staff, Oracle Corp.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (Bob Bradley)
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 1996 22:09:40 -0800
Organization: SPC

In article <19960917174044162819@[194.121.104.137]>, [e-mail] (Peter
W. Gillgasch) wrote:

> Eh, copy protection ? Avoiding competitors to sneak into your code
> to check how you do your magic ?

You might also try putting some communication code in as well so you call
dial 911 during the 10 seconds it takes to get around the debugger
disabling.

If code gets executed to disable the debugger, why would you think it'd be
any harder to disable that as well?

Instead of wasting time on copy protection or attempting to hide code from
competitors, spend that time on making the product better. Your users will
thank you for it.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (Chris Kelly)
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 1996 18:37:05 -0800
Organization: Samizdat Productions

The following worked on my '040. I haven't tried these on other machines,
because I gave up on the idea.

void DisableInterruptSwitch( void )
{
   asm {
      BSET  #7,0xC2C
   }
}

void EnableInterruptSwitch( void )
{
   asm {
      BCLR  #7,0xC2C
   }
}

In article <51iqrs$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (David) wrote:

> Does anyone know how to prevent Macsbug from working in a program? I have
> seen this done (so that the interrupt switch just does nothing), and
> believe it has something to do with "interrupt vectors," but my
> understanding of these is low and so my capability to modify them is even
> less. A pointer to IM (didn't find it in a search) would be great, and if
> anyone has one, a code snippet (Pascal or C) would be wonderful. Thanks
> very much for your help!
>
> David

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From Manuel Veloso <[e-mail]>
Date: 19 Sep 1996 00:58:03 GMT
Organization: Active Paper, Inc.

In article <51iqrs$[e-mail]> David, [e-mail] writes:
>does anyone know how to prevent Macsbug from working in a program?

Well, there are a couple of things you can do:

* patch _debugger and friends
* stuff an RTE into $7C, which is the exception vector
  for the interrupt switch (interrupt level 7, NMI)

I think that the $7C/RTE also kills off _Debugger,
but I'm not positive anymore.

The downside is that (1) this has to happen pretty early in your app, (2)
in
theory, it only applies to your application (I'm not sure if the exception
vectors are swapped on a context switch). If the vectors aren't swapped,
you
could always fire off a VBL task that stomps on 7C every couple of
seconds,
but this'd slow down PowerMacs, which is bad (VBL's are still 68k, aren't
they?).

Note: this is pretty skanky. Be sure to restore the value when your app
exits (patch ExitToShell to make sure). Also, this' likely to irritate
a whole bunch of folks, and who knows what happens if your app happens
to crash.
- ---------------------------------------
Manny Veloso          Digital Plumber
Active Paper, Inc.    http://www.apix.com
- ---------------------------------------
"xoff! xoff!"

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (Donald Lee)
Date: Sun, 22 Sep 1996 14:27:19 -0600
Organization: StarNet Communications, Inc

In article <[e-mail]>,
[e-mail] (Bob Bradley) wrote:

> [some snippped...]
> If code gets executed to disable the debugger, why would you think it'd be
> any harder to disable that as well?
>
> Instead of wasting time on copy protection or attempting to hide code from
> competitors, spend that time on making the product better. Your users will
> thank you for it.

If the whole point is to slow down the hackers, forget it.  It is
always 10 times easier to figure out how a program works than it is to
get it working in the first place.  That goes double for obfuscation.

Whatever effort you put into trying to disable the programmers switch
will be repaid by the following dividends:

    1. You will have lots of fun debugging your code.  (Good luck!
    If you do your job well, any debugger you use will stop working, right?)

    2. Apple will change the inner workings of the vectors and your
    program will crash.  (for the customer of course, not for you)

    3. If you do manage to come up with a scheme that is somehow "supported"
    it will be that much easier to get around it.

    4. You will spend a lot more time than you think ironing out your
    bugs in the "debugger disable" code than you thought possible.

    5. The hackers, in the end, will laugh at you.  Anyone worth a damn
    will find such code immediately and remove/disable it.

Such effort is a waste of time.  Period.  That's what copyrights and patents
are for.

It would be different if you had a prayer of prevailing, or if the industry
didn't experience complete revolution about every 18 months, but that's
the way it is.

Make a better product.  Serve your customers.  Ignore the hackers.
You only hurt your customers by being concerned with them.

-dgl-

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (Daniel Jalkut)
Date: 22 Sep 1996 12:35:15 -0700
Organization: BEST Internet Communications

[e-mail] (Adam Winer) writes:

>In article <[e-mail]>,
>[e-mail] (Paul Baxter) wrote:

(... initial post caption deleted ...)

>AFAIK, this actually doesn't work.  I once tried writing
>up a hack that did just this.  It was a quick-hack OpenDoc part
>that patched DebugStr and displayed all the strings passed in - kinda
>neat, because adding an instance of the part would let you intercept
>all debug strings without breaking into MacsBug.  Unfortunately,
>MacsBug still got all the debug strings.  I didn't have enough
>time to look into this, so I never found out why it happens.
>Anyone know?

I don't know much about what happens between _A9FF and MacsBug taking
over, but the idea of being able to patch them out doesn't make any sense
to me since they are both _Unimplemented traps.  This means that if you
patch it you are replacing code that doesn't exist. I think there is a
spookier mechanism for getting into MacsBug, I'm not sure how it works.

The only useful thing I can think of for patching the Debugger calls is
to get rid of the annoying Unimplemented errors you get when you run
DebugStr'd programmes on a machine without MacsBug installed.

>--
>Adam Winer
>[e-mail]
>Technical Staff, Oracle Corp.

=
AckAck Software
[e-mail]

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From Manuel Veloso <[e-mail]>
Date: 25 Sep 1996 15:54:56 GMT
Organization: Active Paper, Inc.

In article <[e-mail]> Donald Lee,
[e-mail] writes:
>If the whole point is to slow down the hackers, forget it.  It is
>always 10 times easier to figure out how a program works than it is to
>get it working in the first place.  That goes double for obfuscation.

It depends on the market. For horizontal stuff, you probably don't want
to do anything heavy, mainly because it's horizontal. For vertical stuff,
protection is actually almost necessary, since few companies would pop
for 15 copies of your $10,000 easy-to-use vertical app w/o incentive.

>Whatever effort you put into trying to disable the programmers switch
>will be repaid by the following dividends:
>
>    1. You will have lots of fun debugging your code.  (Good luck!
>    If you do your job well, any debugger you use will stop working, right?)

Actually, it won't. If this happens, then you've done something stupid.
Code to wipe the exception vector is actually pretty simple...it's not
like you're doing self-modifying code.

>    2. Apple will change the inner workings of the vectors and your
>    program will crash.  (for the customer of course, not for you)

These are 68K hardware vectors. While they're simulated on the PPC, it's
highly doubtful that they'll change in the near (or far) future.

>    3. If you do manage to come up with a scheme that is somehow "supported"
>    it will be that much easier to get around it.

Well actually, no.

>    4. You will spend a lot more time than you think ironing out your
>    bugs in the "debugger disable" code than you thought possible.

This stuff is fun. I'd say it'd take around 25 minutes to see if the hack
worked, and 2 more days solidifying it.

>    5. The hackers, in the end, will laugh at you.  Anyone worth a damn
>    will find such code immediately and remove/disable it.

You have no idea what you're talking about, do you. Two things you can do
to make life harder for people who want to hack are:

1) stick the code away from "landmarks", like a trap call, etc. This means
   that the VBL should launch before InitGraf, and there should be a
couple
   of places where you make sure the VBL is running. Inline the code, so
   you can't hack just one routine.
2) compile for PowerMacs (which you should do anyway). PPC code is harder
   to read, and a lot more work to slog through.

>Such effort is a waste of time.  Period.  That's what copyrights and patents
>are for.

It depends on how much you have to lose. Remember, horizontal markets are
different from vertical markets. Plus, finding and prosecuting
copyright/patent violators, if you're small, isn't really an option.

>It would be different if you had a prayer of prevailing, or if the industry
>didn't experience complete revolution about every 18 months, but that's
>the way it is.

Uh-huh. So why bother going into software at all, then? Heck, become a
lawyer
instead.
- ---------------------------------------
Manny Veloso          Digital Plumber
Active Paper, Inc.    http://www.apix.com
- ---------------------------------------
"xcoff! xcoff!"

---------------------------

>From [e-mail] (Byron Han)
Subject: Drag Manager questions
Date: 23 Sep 1996 15:46:32 -1000
Organization: LavaNet, Inc.

I am trying to add Drag Manager support to an application that
I am working on.  I would like to add the ability to accept
HFSFlavor's but I noticed in the documentation and assorted
sample code that (a) layer switching is disabled and (b) sending
AppleEvents with kAEWaitReply is not allowed (kAENoReply is ok)

Would it be appropriate for me to take the (set of) HFSFlavor(s)
in my receive procedure, queue them up for later processing,
bring myself to the foreground, and then continue processing?
The reason is that some types of HFSFlavor's will involve bringing
up modal dialogs and other assorted user interaction.

Thanks in advance.
--
Byron Han  *  <http://www.hanchenson.com/~han>  *  <mailto:[e-mail]>
Han Chen & Son - MacOS Software Development * PO Box 61557 * Honolulu HI 96839
"Windows 95 - Can't Get No Satisfaction"

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (David Dunham)
Date: 25 Sep 1996 05:37:59 GMT
Organization: Pensee Corporation

In article <527eho$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Byron Han) wrote:

> Would it be appropriate for me to take the (set of) HFSFlavor(s)
> in my receive procedure, queue them up for later processing,
> bring myself to the foreground, and then continue processing?
> The reason is that some types of HFSFlavor's will involve bringing
> up modal dialogs and other assorted user interaction.

That's what I did in Newton Press. (It looks like ClarisWorks manages not
to do this, however.)

David Dunham   Pensee Corporation   [e-mail]
Voice/Fax: [phone]             http://www.pensee.com/dunham/
    "I say we should listen to the customers and give them what they want."
    "What they want is better products for free." --Scott Adams

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (David Dunham)
Date: 25 Sep 1996 05:37:59 GMT
Organization: Pensee Corporation

In article <527eho$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Byron Han) wrote:

> Would it be appropriate for me to take the (set of) HFSFlavor(s)
> in my receive procedure, queue them up for later processing,
> bring myself to the foreground, and then continue processing?
> The reason is that some types of HFSFlavor's will involve bringing
> up modal dialogs and other assorted user interaction.

That's what I did in Newton Press. (It looks like ClarisWorks manages not
to do this, however.)

David Dunham   Pensee Corporation   [e-mail]
Voice/Fax: [phone]             http://www.pensee.com/dunham/
    "I say we should listen to the customers and give them what they want."
    "What they want is better products for free." --Scott Adams

---------------------------

>From [e-mail] (Todd McDaniel)
Subject: Error in Technote 1069 confirmed
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996 16:38:13 -0400
Organization: University of Michigan

There is an error in technote 1069, describing System Update 7.5.5. The
technote states that the Gestalt 'sysu' value, denoting the System Update
version, for System Update 7.5.5 would be 0x02058000. This is incorrect.
The value is in fact 0x02068000 (note 206, *not* 205). The author of the
note, Brian Bechtel, has confirmed this is the case and will be correcting
the document soon.

I'd like to thank those of you that confirmed what I found, and Brian for
getting back to me as quick as he did.

-todd mcdaniel

--
_______________________________________________________________________________
|[O]***************** Once you go Mac, You never go back! *****************[@]*|
|==============================================================================|
|    Name                     Size Kind           Label        Last Modified |^|
| D  [e-mail]            4K  Address Doc... Primary      Fri, May 5, 19|-|
| D  [e-mail]           4K  Address Doc... Secondary    Wed, Aug 9, 19| |
| *  http://ic.net/~scooter    4K  URL Documen... Home Page    Tue, Jun 6, 19| |
| X  Have Fun, Stay Single    23K  Slogan Docu... Way of Life  Fri, May 24, 1|_|
|____________________________________________________________________________|v|
|<|[E]====================================================================|>|[@]
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------

---------------------------

>From [e-mail] (Brad Pettit)
Subject: Font Editor
Date: Tue, 24 Sep 1996 14:35:13 -0700
Organization: Apple Computer

What are the current options for editing bitmap fonts on the Mac. I have a
TrueType font that I created, but its bitmaps require some tweaking beyond
ResEdit capabilities.

Also, do any font editors create/edit fonts with depths greater than 1 bit?

--Brad

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (Alex Metcalf)
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996 09:18:41 GMT
Organization: (none)

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
(Brad Pettit) wrote:

> What are the current options for editing bitmap fonts on the Mac. I have a
> TrueType font that I created, but its bitmaps require some tweaking beyond
> ResEdit capabilities.
>
> Also, do any font editors create/edit fonts with depths greater than 1 bit?

     Font editing was a really big thing several years ago, and there were
several programs around which did what you want (at least, with Type 1
fonts as they were). However, I haven't heard anything about font editors
for ages, so I don't know what's available. One program name I do remember
is "Fontographer"; try asking on csm.graphics.




     Alex

--
Alex Metcalf
[e-mail]

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (Brad Pettit)
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996 12:05:44 -0700
Organization: Apple Computer

In article <[e-mail]>,
[e-mail] (Alex Metcalf) wrote:

> In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
> (Brad Pettit) wrote:
>
> > What are the current options for editing bitmap fonts on the Mac. I have a
> > TrueType font that I created, but its bitmaps require some tweaking beyond
> > ResEdit capabilities.
> >
> > Also, do any font editors create/edit fonts with depths greater than 1 bit?
>
>      Font editing was a really big thing several years ago, and there were
> several programs around which did what you want (at least, with Type 1
> fonts as they were). However, I haven't heard anything about font editors
> for ages, so I don't know what's available. One program name I do remember
> is "Fontographer"; try asking on csm.graphics.
>
>      Alex
>
> --
> Alex Metcalf
> [e-mail]

I have Fontographer, however, that only edits the outline font. I need
something to tweak the bitmap. Fontographer does a lousy job at creating
small bitmap versions. Thanks for the csm.graphics referral.

--Brad

---------------------------

>From [e-mail] (Bill Vaughan)
Subject: How to do scripting on a Mac?
Date: 24 Sep 1996 21:14:48 GMT
Organization: Sun Microsystems Inc.


I need a way to do Unix-like shell scripting on the Mac to set environment variables and run tools/apps without having to go through the GUI. (No, I'm not one of those Unix/DOS Neandrathals who walks around grunting, "Me, I REAL man, I use command line interface. GUI for sissies.") I am setting up a test harness which needs to work on multi-platforms. I've considered AppleScript, but the problem is that some of the tools/apps I will be working with are not AppleScript Aware. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

Bill


+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (Raymond Cote)
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996 08:21:56 GMT
Organization: Appropriate Solutions, Inc.

In article <529j08$[e-mail]>, [e-mail] wrote:

> I need a way to do Unix-like shell scripting on the Mac to set
environment variables and run tools/apps without having to go through the
GUI. (No, I'm not one of those Unix/DOS Neandrathals who walks around
grunting, "Me, I REAL man, I use command line interface. GUI for
sissies.") I am setting up a test harness which needs to work on
multi-platforms. I've considered AppleScript, but the problem is that some
of the tools/apps I will be working with are not AppleScript Aware. Any
suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Bill

Bill,
  Have you looked at MPW? A bit cryptic (I'm saying that to a Unix guy?)
but powerful with looping, environment variables, ability to launch
applications, run shell-level applications, etc. You don't state whether
or not the applications you're testing are a portable test suite or Mac
specific. If these are Unix tools you're running on the Mac, MPW might be
a good solution for you.
Ray
--
Raymond Cote -- [e-mail]  --  Appropriate Solutions, Inc.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From Rudi Angela <[e-mail]>
Date: 25 Sep 1996 07:29:40 GMT
Organization: Informaat B.V.

If it's for testing applications you can use Apple's 'Virtual User'. VU
lets you control several Macs from one master machine by emulating a
user. This also works with non-scriptable apps, as long as they have
some user interface.

Rudi Angela

---------------------------

>From [e-mail] (Kevin Redden)
Subject: MacODBC & CFM68K
Date: Tue, 24 Sep 1996 10:05:24 -0400
Organization: PC Docs, Inc.

I'm looking for some developers using or thinking of using Visigenics MacODBC.

I have been trying to get them to support CFM 68K instead of ASLM for
quite some time now.  I mentioned to them that since they already support
PowerPC CFM that it shouldn't be more than a few days work at worst to
port to CFM 68K and they agreed that it was not a big engineering issue.
Their Mac engineering manager still doesn't want to do it because he
claims that there have been *NO* requests for it.  Given that I made a
public specific request directly to him at the last WWDC in one of the
database sessions I find this hard to believe!  The audience burst out
into applause when I asked the question and I would take that as being
worth a couple more requests at least...

The reason for this post is that I would like to get a list of developers
that would like to see this so I can send Visigenics the list of names.
Please let me know if you are already registered with them or if you have
put off support waiting for CFM 68K.

Please send me e-mail directly ([e-mail]) instead of replying to
the list.

Thanks,
Kevin

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (Peter Teeson)
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996 06:10:09 -0700
Organization: General Consulting & Research Inc.

In article <kevinr-2409961005390001@199.44.115.125>, [e-mail]
(Kevin Redden) wrote:


> Please send me e-mail directly ([e-mail]) instead of replying to
> the list.


I have sent you a detailed email about our request for it last year.

Peter

--
Peter Teeson
General Consulting & Research Inc.
712 - 24 Forest Manor Road
Willowdale, ON
M2J 1M3

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (vlod kalicun)
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996 18:08:49 +0000
Organization: I.I.S.C.

In article <kevinr-2409961005390001@199.44.115.125>, [e-mail]
(Kevin Redden) wrote:


>The reason for this post is that I would like to get a list of developers
>that would like to see this so I can send Visigenics the list of names.
>Please let me know if you are already registered with them or if you have
>put off support waiting for CFM 68K.

sorry i forgot to mention, that we are already registered with them.

*********************************************************************
*        Vlod Kalicun            | Wingz/HyperScript Tools Dev.Team *
*"A disaster waiting to happen!" | Investment Inteligience Sys Corp.*
*       [e-mail]           | London, England. www.wingz.com   *
*********************************************************************

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (vlod kalicun)
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996 18:08:49 +0000
Organization: I.I.S.C.

In article <kevinr-2409961005390001@199.44.115.125>, [e-mail]
(Kevin Redden) wrote:


>The reason for this post is that I would like to get a list of developers
>that would like to see this so I can send Visigenics the list of names.
>Please let me know if you are already registered with them or if you have
>put off support waiting for CFM 68K.

sorry i forgot to mention, that we are already registered with them.

*********************************************************************
*        Vlod Kalicun            | Wingz/HyperScript Tools Dev.Team *
*"A disaster waiting to happen!" | Investment Inteligience Sys Corp.*
*       [e-mail]           | London, England. www.wingz.com   *
*********************************************************************

---------------------------

>From [e-mail] (Daniel Nash)
Subject: MacOS 8 suggestion (Re: Disk space efficiency)
Date: Wed, 18 Sep 1996 00:59:31 -0600
Organization: University of Wisconsin, Madison

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Andrew
Plotkin) wrote:

:  Lars Farm ([e-mail]) wrote:
:  > The suggestion to use partitions is no cure for the problem unless you
:  > completely fill the partition, which is unrealistic.

:  Well, the problem isn't a *problem* unless you completely fill your hard
:  drive. :-) (Wasted space isn't a problem if you still have some left,
:  right?)

:  The more intuitive statement of the problem is that each partition is
:  limited to 65536 files. (This isn't exactly equivalent to the
:  minimum-block-size constraint, but I believe it is the actual system
:  limitation that caused the minimum-block-size constraint to be
:  implemented.) Partitioning obviously does help this.

:  > The free space of
:  > an artificial partition is also unusable waste.

:  Not if you've already divided up your hard drive into several
:  large folders, of which you can move a subset to the new partition.

:  Keeping track of this is a pain in the butt, and we shouldn't have to do
:  it. Absolutely. Unfortunately, releasing a new file system is a pain in
:  its own set of butts.

Well, a nice feature to have in MacOS 8 (I know it's probably a bit late
for changes now) would be to have the ability to mount volumes as a folder
on another volume, as in most UNIXes.  That way, you could set up your
partition, and then place them all into one desktop 'drive' icon.  I hope
someone form Apple is listening.

 - Daniel Nash

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From Laurent Pointal <[e-mail]>
Date: Tue, 24 Sep 1996 13:28:29 +0200
Organization: CNRS - LURE

Daniel Nash wrote:
[STUFF DELETED]
> Well, a nice feature to have in MacOS 8 (I know it's probably a bit late
> for changes now) would be to have the ability to mount volumes as a folder
> on another volume, as in most UNIXes.  That way, you could set up your
> partition, and then place them all into one desktop 'drive' icon.  I hope
> someone form Apple is listening.
>
>  - Daniel Nash

? Cant an alias of a partition (volume) do the same thing ?
The difference: its just mounted when accessed and not a boot time/mount
command.


--
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------
Laurent POINTAL
CNRS/CEA/MEN - LURE - Service Informatique Experiences
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------
Adresse: LURE - Batiment 209C - Universite Paris XI - 91405 Orsay Cedex
Tel    : [phone]                            Fax : [phone]
email  : [e-mail] (boulot)   [e-mail] (perso)
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (Daniel Nash)
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996 02:44:14 -0600
Organization: University of Wisconsin, Madison

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] wrote:

:  Daniel Nash wrote:
:  [STUFF DELETED]
:  > Well, a nice feature to have in MacOS 8 (I know it's probably a bit late
:  > for changes now) would be to have the ability to mount volumes as a folder
:  > on another volume, as in most UNIXes.  That way, you could set up your
:  > partition, and then place them all into one desktop 'drive' icon.  I hope
:  > someone form Apple is listening.

:  >  - Daniel Nash

:  ? Cant an alias of a partition (volume) do the same thing ?
:  The difference: its just mounted when accessed and not a boot time/mount
:  command.

Yeah, you're right, that's a pretty simple solution.  I would like to get
rid of some desktop clutter, though.  (i.e. I go insane with 8 or 9 HD
partitions)

 - Daniel Nash

---------------------------

>From Axel Rauschmayer <[e-mail]>
Subject: OpenDoc for Linux?
Date: Fri, 13 Sep 1996 16:54:17 +0200
Organization: Institut fuer Informatik der Universitaet Muenchen

Now that the Mac-community finally gets Linux: Is there an OpenDoc for
Linux? As IBM is already working on a Unix port (AIX), a Linux version
shouldn't be too had to do.

IMHO such a port could be beneficial for both sides: The OpenDoc community
would gain good developers and OpenDoc would even become more interesting
as more platforms are supported (also: isn't Micros*ft doing a Unix port
of ActiveX?). And Linux gains a component architecture and potentially
drag & drop and a clipboard (one of the biggest drawbacks when comparing
it to the MacOS).

Comments, hints, suggestions? Please reply by email, too.

Thanks,

Axel

- ----------------------------------------------------------------------
Axel Rauschmayer   mailto:[e-mail]    \ | /
                   http://www.lrz-muenchen.de/~ug201cz/www/       0 0
- --------------------------------------------------------------w--U--w-


+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (Daniel Nash)
Date: Sat, 14 Sep 1996 01:05:01 -0600
Organization: University of Wisconsin, Madison

In article
<[e-mail]-muenchen.
de>, Axel Rauschmayer <[e-mail]> wrote:

:  Now that the Mac-community finally gets Linux: Is there an OpenDoc for
:  Linux? As IBM is already working on a Unix port (AIX), a Linux version
:  shouldn't be too had to do.
:
:  IMHO such a port could be beneficial for both sides: The OpenDoc community
:  would gain good developers and OpenDoc would even become more interesting
:  as more platforms are supported (also: isn't Micros*ft doing a Unix port
:  of ActiveX?). And Linux gains a component architecture and potentially
:  drag & drop and a clipboard (one of the biggest drawbacks when comparing
:  it to the MacOS).
:
:  Comments, hints, suggestions? Please reply by email, too.

I think that's a great idea.  There are a lot of developers in the Linux
community.  By gaining supporters for OpenDoc for Linux, they would
probably also get a large number of developers who would write a part or
part editor for Linux, and then port it to a number of other platforms.  A
move like this would be extremely beneficial to the OpenDoc community.  I
hope they're listening.

 - Daniel Nash

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (vlod kalicun)
Date: Fri, 20 Sep 1996 15:12:30 +0000
Organization: I.I.S.C.

In article
<[e-mail]>,
Axel Rauschmayer <[e-mail]> wrote:

>Now that the Mac-community finally gets Linux: Is there an OpenDoc for
>Linux? As IBM is already working on a Unix port (AIX), a Linux version
>shouldn't be too had to do.

IBM actually demo Opendoc for AIX at apple-expo boston. It looked quit
smokey.

-vlod

*********************************************************************
*        Vlod Kalicun            | Wingz/HyperScript Tools Dev.Team *
*"A disaster waiting to happen!" | Investment Inteligience Sys Corp.*
*       [e-mail]           | London, England. www.wingz.com   *
*********************************************************************

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From "John W. Baxter" <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 21 Sep 1996 10:12:03 -0700
Organization: Internet for the Olympic Peninsula

vlod kalicun wrote:
> IBM actually demo Opendoc for AIX at apple-expo boston. It looked quit
> smokey.

Sorry...I'm too old, I guess.  Is "smokey" good or bad this week?

--
John W. Baxter    [e-mail]
     The primary cause of problems is solutions.
Port Ludlow, WA, USA  (Thank you, USWest!)

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (Jude Giampaolo)
Date: Sat, 21 Sep 1996 15:27:41 -0400
Organization: CyberDrugs

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] wrote:

> vlod kalicun wrote:
> > IBM actually demo Opendoc for AIX at apple-expo boston. It looked quit
> > smokey.
>
> Sorry...I'm too old, I guess.  Is "smokey" good or bad this week?

Maybe the machine caught on fire?

--
Jude Charles Giampaolo         'There's not much to see actually,
[e-mail]                we're inside a Chinese dragon...'
[e-mail]      http://prozac.cwru.edu/jude/JudeHome.html
Mac NFS serevr:   http://prozac.cwru.edu/jude/macnfs/Macnfsd.html

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From "John W. Baxter" <[e-mail]>
Date: Sat, 21 Sep 1996 10:12:03 -0700
Organization: Internet for the Olympic Peninsula

Reposting article removed by rogue canceller.

vlod kalicun wrote:
> IBM actually demo Opendoc for AIX at apple-expo boston. It looked quit
> smokey.

Sorry...I'm too old, I guess.  Is "smokey" good or bad this week?

--
John W. Baxter    [e-mail]
     The primary cause of problems is solutions.
Port Ludlow, WA, USA  (Thank you, USWest!)

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (Jude Giampaolo)
Date: Sat, 21 Sep 1996 15:27:41 -0400
Organization: CyberDrugs

Reposting article removed by rogue canceller.

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] wrote:

> vlod kalicun wrote:
> > IBM actually demo Opendoc for AIX at apple-expo boston. It looked quit
> > smokey.
>
> Sorry...I'm too old, I guess.  Is "smokey" good or bad this week?

Maybe the machine caught on fire?

--
Jude Charles Giampaolo         'There's not much to see actually,
[e-mail]                we're inside a Chinese dragon...'
[e-mail]      http://prozac.cwru.edu/jude/JudeHome.html
Mac NFS serevr:   http://prozac.cwru.edu/jude/macnfs/Macnfsd.html

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] (vlod kalicun)
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996 18:02:03 +0000
Organization: I.I.S.C.

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] wrote:

>Reposting article removed by rogue canceller.
>
>vlod kalicun wrote:
>> IBM actually demo Opendoc for AIX at apple-expo boston. It looked quit
>> smokey.
>
>Sorry...I'm too old, I guess.  Is "smokey" good or bad this week?
>
>--
>John W. Baxter    [e-mail]
>     The primary cause of problems is solutions.
>Port Ludlow, WA, USA  (Thank you, USWest!)

Sorry,
Its means 'good' and impressive.
I guess its the british sense of humour!

-vlod

*********************************************************************
*        Vlod Kalicun            | Wingz/HyperScript Tools Dev.Team *
*"A disaster waiting to happen!" | Investment Inteligience Sys Corp.*
*       [e-mail]           | London, England. www.wingz.com   *
*********************************************************************

---------------------------

>From Yury Peskin <[e-mail]>
Subject: Renaming Files
Date: Tue, 24 Sep 1996 12:36:58 -0500
Organization: Vendor Systems International, Inc.

Hello all,

I was wandering (and hoping) that someone may have a utility to convert
file names from lower to upper case. The problem is that we have a
folder with 3,000 files in it and we need to convert them all to
uppercase names.  Does any one have such a tool?

Thanks in advance,

Yury P.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

>From [e-mail] ( nick.c @MT )
Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996 12:55:19 -0800
Organization: MacTech Magazine



<[e-mail]> wrote:

>I was wandering (and hoping) that someone may have a utility to convert
>file names from lower to upper case. The problem is that we have a
>folder with 3,000 files in it and we need to convert them all to
>uppercase names.  Does any one have such a tool?



   Jason Townsend wrote a shareware program called "Guillotine" that
     (by default) changes the file name of files dropped onto it
     to all lower case.  If you hold down the command key when
     you drop them, they're converted to all uppercase.  Here's
     a link to a copy of Guillotine.  Luck,

<ftp://mirrors.aol.com//pub/info-mac/_Disk_%26_File/guillotine-10a3.hqx>